Burchill Sacked, Hopkin New Head Coach

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Who would you like to be next manager

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29% [29%] 
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0% [0%] 
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0% [0%] 
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14% [14%] 
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Total Votes: 14
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Liviforever

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Re: Burchill Sacked, Hopkin New Head Coach

Post by Liviforever on Wed Jan 06, 2016 8:02 pm

ol1vercloff wrote:
Liviforever wrote:When Newcastle have gone through 2 admins, constant signing embargo's, lost all their best players and  had them replaced by junior league ones, had a punishment of being demoted to the bottom tier, and are still being screwed by the bampots in charge of their club, then i'll compare like for like with their great fans.

Those things shouldn't determine how well supported a team is.  Those that give up when things get rough are normally referred to as fair weather fans.  You either support the team you love whatever happens or you don't call yourself a supporter.


Don't think we've had any fair weather at Livi for over 12 years, it has been raining that much we've all developed web feet.

Nope I can't agree with you there, after all we've gone through it's a miracle the fans we've got are still here, and to call them the worst fans in the world is just ludicrous. If Newcastle had gone through what Livi had I doubt they'd have the fans they have still backing them, so again a nonsense to hold them in such high regard while dissing our support. The diehard Livi fans are as passionate and loyal as any team's fans in the world.

The ones that help out on match days, turning out whenever needed, clearing snow, lifting covers etc, are as good, if not better, than any Newcastle fan.

Troy

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Re: Burchill Sacked, Hopkin New Head Coach

Post by Troy on Wed Jan 06, 2016 8:47 pm

I feel there has been a knee jerk reaction to all the goings on at the moment.I Personally feel the club made a poor decision on this matter.Ijust wish we hadnt heard of all the interviews and cvs being considered when they had obviously made their minds up.If as has been mentioned by some it was purely down to financial circumstances then fair dues.I for one will continue to give my full support to the club in any way i can.I have nothing against Davie Hopkin as such but god help him if it goes wrong although i fear devine intervention may not be enough to save him.Prove me wrong Hoppy.
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LiviLion

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Re: Burchill Sacked, Hopkin New Head Coach

Post by LiviLion on Wed Jan 06, 2016 9:16 pm

ol1vercloff wrote:
We're not exactly an example of the best fans in the world, are we?

A lot of our fans are passionate about bollocking the players and management but not passionate about supporting or following the team.  Pretty grim.

So not the best automatically means the worst? Livi fans are a bunch of moaners but no where near the worst.
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Liviforever

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Re: Burchill Sacked, Hopkin New Head Coach

Post by Liviforever on Wed Jan 06, 2016 10:21 pm

He can't have been to St Mirren away games this season if he thinks we're the worst moaners.
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LiviLion

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Re: Burchill Sacked, Hopkin New Head Coach

Post by LiviLion on Wed Jan 06, 2016 10:50 pm

Liviforever wrote:He can't have been to St Mirren away games this season if he thinks we're the worst moaners.

Or Cowdenbeath, or The Rangers.

And that's just teams we've played recently.

ol1vercloff

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Re: Burchill Sacked, Hopkin New Head Coach

Post by ol1vercloff on Thu Jan 07, 2016 5:18 pm

Liviforever wrote:Don't think we've had any fair weather at Livi for over 12 years, it has been raining that much we've all developed web feet.

Nope I can't agree with you there, after all we've gone through it's a miracle the fans we've got are still here, and to call them the worst fans in the world is just ludicrous. If Newcastle had gone through what Livi had I doubt they'd have the fans they have still backing them, so again a nonsense to hold them in such high regard while dissing our support. The diehard Livi fans are as passionate and loyal as any team's fans in the world.

The ones that help out on match days, turning out whenever needed, clearing snow, lifting covers etc, are as good, if not better, than any Newcastle fan.

I can remember beyond the last 12 years, when an attendance of 3000-4000 was considered a poor crowd.  The ground was full of glory hunters every other week until we went down then you started to see the real supporters.  Even these days there's evidence of fair weather fans, especially on this very forum, refusing to return to games because things aren't going very well.  I know one or two season ticket holders at Newcastle Utd and they would follow their team even if they were playing Sunday league!  We'll never have resources like theirs but no reason why we can't have a passionate support like they do.  A club hitting hard times is not a reason to stop going to games!

LiviLion wrote:So not the best automatically means the worst? Livi fans are a bunch of moaners but no where near the worst.

Not automatically but I can't think of many worse fans.  I just wish we could mirror the 'rallying round' mentality that other teams have shown in the past when facing difficult times.

Liviforever wrote:He can't have been to St Mirren away games this season if he thinks we're the worst moaners.

You're right, I wasn't there but St Mirren's attendances in their last few home games suggest that their fans don't just stop turning up when the going gets tough.  Some might say they have more reason to be upset with how things are going than we do.  SPL last season, shite this season and all that. At least they turn up to games to moan instead of doing it behind a keyboard.
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Liviforever

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Re: Burchill Sacked, Hopkin New Head Coach

Post by Liviforever on Thu Jan 07, 2016 6:05 pm

ol1vercloff wrote:
Liviforever wrote:Don't think we've had any fair weather at Livi for over 12 years, it has been raining that much we've all developed web feet.

Nope I can't agree with you there, after all we've gone through it's a miracle the fans we've got are still here, and to call them the worst fans in the world is just ludicrous. If Newcastle had gone through what Livi had I doubt they'd have the fans they have still backing them, so again a nonsense to hold them in such high regard while dissing our support. The diehard Livi fans are as passionate and loyal as any team's fans in the world.

The ones that help out on match days, turning out whenever needed, clearing snow, lifting covers etc, are as good, if not better, than any Newcastle fan.

I can remember beyond the last 12 years, when an attendance of 3000-4000 was considered a poor crowd.  The ground was full of glory hunters every other week until we went down then you started to see the real supporters.  Even these days there's evidence of fair weather fans, especially on this very forum, refusing to return to games because things aren't going very well.  I know one or two season ticket holders at Newcastle Utd and they would follow their team even if they were playing Sunday league!  We'll never have resources like theirs but no reason why we can't have a passionate support like they do.  A club hitting hard times is not a reason to stop going to games!.

And you really think there aren't any Livi fans that would do the same?

Att have dropped all over Scotland, in the top tier too, and there are fair weather fans in every club, but none (NONE) of them have gone through what Livi fans have, so until they have you can forget trying to say any are better.

ol1vercloff wrote:
Liviforever wrote:;]He can't have been to St Mirren away games this season if he thinks we're the worst moaners.

You're right, I wasn't there but St Mirren's attendances in their last few home games suggest that their fans don't just stop turning up when the going gets tough.  

You're a fair weather away fan then?  lol!

Only Livi fans wouldn't consider what St Mirren fans are going through to be tough, they're only just down from the top tier for goodness sake, it's like comparing a skint knee to an amputated leg in comparison to what Livi have gone through.


ol1vercloff wrote:
Some might say they have more reason to be upset with how things are going than we do.  SPL last season, shite this season and all that.  At least they turn up to games to moan instead of doing it behind a keyboard.


I can't even take you seriously now.

2 admins, court cases, incl ongoing ones, constant debt and admin 3 hanging over our heads, multiple head bangers/crooks as owners, revolving door in the managers office, no stability for over a decade, points deductions, embargo's, relegation to the 2nd tier and then booted down into the bottom tier as another punishment, and that's just the off field shite we've had to put up with, not even bothering with the making your eyes bleed football we've had to watch at times. And yet we're still here buying a ST and will still be buying one next season too even if we're relegated. I sometimes question my sanity in being a Livi fan right enough but I don't blame any other Livi fan for having enough of the crap being heaped on us.

Yeah i'm just a shite Livi supporter not anywhere near as good as St Mirren or Newcastle fans. bounce
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Afro

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Re: Burchill Sacked, Hopkin New Head Coach

Post by Afro on Thu Jan 07, 2016 6:16 pm

I don't think you can really blame people for finally throwing the towel in, given there has been little positivity coming out of the club for the best part of 2 years. Then before that there was two administrations, various bouts of totally shite teams playing guff football, and PR disaster after disaster; it's not really difficult to see why folk get put off.

I'd contest that still getting the number of season ticket holders that we do given the absolute shitstorms the club seem to lurch from year in, year out, is fairly indicative of the "loyalty" that seems to be contested here.

ol1vercloff

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Re: Burchill Sacked, Hopkin New Head Coach

Post by ol1vercloff on Thu Jan 07, 2016 7:10 pm

Liviforever wrote:And you really think there aren't any Livi fans that would do the same?

Att have dropped all over Scotland, in the top tier too, and there are fair weather fans in every club, but none (NONE) of them have gone through what Livi fans have, so until they have you can forget trying to say any are better.

I think our attendances would drop to double figures if we went non-league.  That's being generous.  I don't get why you think going through all the negative stuff justifies not going to games or not supporting your team anymore.  I love Livingston now more than I ever did, even in the SPL days!

Liviforever wrote:;]You're a fair weather away fan then?  lol!

Only Livi fans wouldn't consider what St Mirren fans are going through to be tough, they're only just down from the top tier for goodness sake, it's like comparing a skint knee to an amputated leg in comparison to what Livi have gone through.

I've never been a good weather away fan so GIRUY  Laughing

Again...'what Livi have gone through'.  In my opinion, that doesn't matter.  When you're a kid, you pick a team and you support them to the bitter end, regardless of what issues they have or how hopeless they are at times.

Liviforever wrote:I can't even take you seriously now.

2 admins, court cases, incl ongoing ones, constant debt and admin 3 hanging over our heads, multiple head bangers/crooks as owners, revolving door in the managers office, no stability for over a decade, points deductions, embargo's, relegation to the 2nd tier and then booted down into the bottom tier as another punishment, and that's just the off field shite we've had to put up with, not even bothering with the making your eyes bleed football we've had to watch at times. And yet we're still here buying a ST and will still be buying one next season too even if we're relegated.  I sometimes question my sanity in being a Livi fan right enough but I don't blame any other Livi fan for having enough of the crap being heaped on us.

Yeah i'm just a shite Livi supporter not anywhere near as good as St Mirren or Newcastle fans. bounce

You and me both.  But you're telling me that when you read on here that some supporters, who already have a paid for season ticket, decide to stop coming because we're playing crap, it doesn't make you look at other teams that have a passionate support and wish we come mirror them?  Even watching some non-league football down south, their crowds are so much better than ours but I believe the Scottish Championship is a much more entertaining league than the Conference.  How come more of our supporters spit the dummy out than theirs?
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Liviforever

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Re: Burchill Sacked, Hopkin New Head Coach

Post by Liviforever on Thu Jan 07, 2016 9:23 pm

Like I said, what other teams fans are like don't interest me, why would I look at some team who has never went through what we've gone through and think they're a great example, lucky them that they haven't had the horrendous trials that Livi fans have.

If I want to look for fans to admire I could look at our own fans and admire the fine work our volunteers do, what ordinary Newcastle fan does a fraction of the work for their club some of ours does? Don't have to look at other teams for fans to admire.

I don't actually understand why you keep ignoring the fine work our volunteers do and instead keep banging on about fans of some other team that have no like for like comparison to even deserve to be held up as an example. There are plenty passionate, and good, Livi fans. Feck other teams fans Very Happy Cool .

ol1vercloff

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Re: Burchill Sacked, Hopkin New Head Coach

Post by ol1vercloff on Thu Jan 07, 2016 9:52 pm

Liviforever wrote:Like I said, what other teams fans are like don't interest me, why would I look at some team who has never went through what we've gone through and think they're a great example, lucky them that they haven't had the horrendous trials that Livi fans have.

If I want to look for fans to admire I could look at our own fans and admire the fine work our volunteers do, what ordinary Newcastle fan does a fraction of the work for their club some of ours does? Don't have to look at other teams for fans to admire.

I don't actually understand why you keep ignoring the fine work our volunteers do and instead keep banging on about fans of some other team that have no like for like comparison to even deserve to be held up as an example. There are plenty passionate, and good, Livi fans. Feck other teams fans Very Happy  Cool .

Again, does not matter what we've been through with our team. I think, for some, 'what we've been through' is just a bit of an excuse for them to be negative and bollock the team.

Not ignoring the work the volunteering fans do, hats off to them, they all deserve medals. If there was a league table for fans volunteering, we'd be reigning champions. But for me, it's not about that. My issue is with the fans that decide not to turn up and support the team when things aren't going as well as they could be on or off the pitch. I appreciate that we don't have a large fan base anyway and a lot of the bums on seats during the SPL days were bums that used to sit at Ibrox, Parkhead, Easter Road etc and just wanted to see live football and ride the band wagon. But I think now we're left with the people that, if asked, would say they are Livingston supporters. So it's disappointing when those people decide to give up, almost acting surprised that a team running on a slashed budget is worse than it was the year before. What do these people think will happen to the club if other people decide to follow in their footsteps?
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Liviforever

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Re: Burchill Sacked, Hopkin New Head Coach

Post by Liviforever on Fri Jan 08, 2016 10:09 am

Again, it absolutely does matter what we've gone through, course it does, you're saying life experience doesn't have any impact on people, really? Same as it is easy to follow a team when things are going great, the opposite is also true. Some people can only take so much of being shat on by crooks and charlatans running our club. You can only take so many admins, one is perhaps unlucky, two is getting beyond a joke, three? Well I think we'd be finished as an SPFL club, and it wouldn't be the fans fault either.

It is funny how two people can have such different experiences from the same game, earlier you mentioned the Cowdenbeath game from last season, and commented on hearing one person being negative after we'd gone a goal behind. What I heard was our fans, who turned up in good numbers on a cold and miserable winter's day, vocally backing the team from start to finish. We were sitting bottom of the league, looking relegated, this was last chance saloon on hanging onto a last strand of a life line, but even going a goal behind our fans got right behind the team. It was the best atmosphere i'd experienced at any game last season. The players and manager commented about how much they appreciated the fans vocal support that day.

Yet you never mentioned that, all you got from that great support was one person being negative, that kinda sums up your whole argument here. Ignore all the good Livi fans and concentrate on one negative comment, while admiring a couple of Newcastle fans you know, and thinking a fan who has had it relatively good supporting a team can be compared to one who has seen nothing but negativity for over a decade. Aye, very good..

ol1vercloff

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Re: Burchill Sacked, Hopkin New Head Coach

Post by ol1vercloff on Fri Jan 08, 2016 4:10 pm

Liviforever wrote:Again, it absolutely does matter what we've gone through, course it does, you're saying life experience doesn't have any impact on people, really? Same as it is easy to follow a team when things are going great, the opposite is also true. Some people can only take so much of being shat on by crooks and charlatans running our club. You can only take so many admins, one is perhaps unlucky, two is getting beyond a joke, three? Well I think we'd be finished as an SPFL club, and it wouldn't be the fans fault either.

It is funny how two people can have such different experiences from the same game, earlier you mentioned the Cowdenbeath game from last season, and commented on hearing one person being negative after we'd gone a goal behind. What I heard was our fans, who turned up in good numbers on a cold and miserable winter's day, vocally backing the team from start to finish. We were sitting bottom of the league, looking relegated, this was last chance saloon on hanging onto a last strand of a life line, but even going a goal behind our fans got right behind the team. It was the best atmosphere i'd experienced at any game last season. The players and manager commented about how much they appreciated the fans vocal support that day.

Yet you never mentioned that, all you got from that great support was one person being negative, that kinda sums up your whole argument here. Ignore all the good Livi fans and concentrate on one negative comment, while admiring a couple of Newcastle fans you know, and thinking a fan who has had it relatively good supporting a team can be compared to one who has seen nothing but negativity for over a decade. Aye, very good..

Some life experiences will affect different people in different ways, but Livingston FC experiences have not affected my love for the club in a negative way at all. I guess everyone is different but it doesn't matter to me what we've gone through, I'm still Livi 'till I die and as long as I have money in my pocket, I'll buy my season ticket and get to as many games as I can no matter division we're in. Each to their own though.

You must have me confused with someone else, I never mentioned the Cowdenbeath game Laughing but the Livi fans that turned up that day were brilliant.

I don't tend to judge a support by how often they shovel snow or whatever. The decrease in attendances does not suggest that just one man is being negative and vowing not to return. I'm not saying there are no good Livi fans, I didn't think I had to clarify that I don't think all of our fan base is bad, but when you group the supporters together and compare them to most other teams, I believe they are the worst. Every club has disappointments at different levels. Newcastle were used to Champions League football for years then found themselves in the Championship, got themselves back up but are looking like heading for the drop again. Geordies are not content with no silverware and finishing near the bottom of the league every season. They don't just accept it because there are other teams in worse situations. They continue to pack out their stadium every other week regardless because they love their club to death. I just wish we had more loyal fans.

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